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at the end of it says the woman would supply what the man was lacking in the design of creation and logically it would follow that the man would supply what she was lacking.
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So here’s what the helper does.
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They bring something to the table that the original did not have.
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You bring something to the table that I don’t have.
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Oh and likewise you for me.
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Right.
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Absolutely.
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And you voice away from it.
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Welcome to the Alright.
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So we are joining you folks from the studio,
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we’ve got our producer todd here and this is our last podcast of 2021.
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We made it,
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we survived 2021.
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So we’re we’re all happy about this.
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But we we got a few more days left.
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Absolutely.
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So today we’re gonna be touching base and and just talking through this concept of gender roles.
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And I think that this carries a lot of baggage for a lot of christians for a lot of churches,
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depending on the church traditions that you’re coming out of.
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And I know that for myself,
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I had this really funny conversation a few summers ago where I sat down with this woman who was engaged wonderful lady fiance,
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really wonderful guy.
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And um in talking through things,
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perhaps she was trying to sound more spiritual to me.
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Perhaps she was trying to say I’m on a good course for things and how things are going right now.
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But she said jennifer,
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we want a biblical marriage and sounds like a good idea.
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I mean that’s we encourage that.
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Right?
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Well,
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it depends on what you mean by that.
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Right?
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You’re talking about.
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I mean we were this is a christian podcast.
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It should be biblical.
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That’s what we’re trying to do,
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right?
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We’re a thriving marriage is a biblical marriage,
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right?
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But what kind of marriage?
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Let’s talk about examples of this.
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So are we talking about Abraham and Sarah and Abraham is lying.
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Abraham.
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Abraham is great,
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right?
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He’s the father of Judah.
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He was the first one.
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He got the promise from God,
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he should have this locked in,
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right?
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No,
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he’s not the perfect one,
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right?
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Just like we’re not perfect.
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So the way that it works out,
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Abraham was lying to other people saying Sarah was his sister almost married her off.
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And that caused a lot of turmoil That by the way,
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don’t try to marry off your wife and you haven’t done that to me yet.
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So I appreciate that.
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So are we dealing with jealous sisterly polygamy at its best or worst,
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depending on how you’re looking at this,
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this is Rachel and Leah with Jacob and all of that drama that looks like it could be a reality show in 2021 on some sort of a cable network or a streaming service.
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So no,
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you don’t want those kinds of biblical marriages if you will.
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But I’ve also noticed that sometimes people will say,
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well,
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I want a biblical marriage and the subtext of that really means well,
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we’re not having sex before we got married.
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So good on you.
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That that’s a good thing to hold onto and to not have happened before you get married.
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But I think that’s an important point to bring up right now.
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You bring up this idea,
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you know,
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okay,
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we we were pure before marriage.
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And that’s a lot of we’ve talked about this before.
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A lot of churches really focus on that purity and to the point though,
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that it gets elevated,
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hey,
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if we can pull off this one thing,
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then we’re good to go.
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But that’s the bare minimum standard.
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That’s not thriving.
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That’s just meeting the basics,
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right?
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But what I’d say to that too is God is a god of the do overs the start overs the redemption.
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So even if people are making those kinds of mistakes before they get married,
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jesus is here to redeem at all,
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which is a fantastic kind of thing.
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Absolutely.
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Absolutely.
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At the same time,
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I mean,
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you want a thriving marriage.
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It’s more than just,
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oh,
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we we followed these rules and really getting into gender roles.
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And this idea of biblical marriage.
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What are the biblical gender roles?
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It gets really interesting.
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And we’ll talk about that some more,
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we’ll get into Ephesians where they really tie into those gender roles,
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A lot of the couple’s when we’ve done the pre marital,
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they’ll get and say,
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hey,
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we want this biblical marriage and we want to be able to have this experience.
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And so then we ask,
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okay,
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so how are you going to manage things in the house?
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This is a big deal when you first get married and those of you who are married listening this,
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you know what I’m talking about?
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You’ve been living either if it was like jen and I,
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we were living with our parents for all through this until,
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I mean we were in college and things,
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but we,
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our first home outside of our parents home was together.
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And so we had these things,
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but a lot of people now they’re starting their lives as singles and they have their own house.
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They have an apartment.
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They have all this stuff figured out about how,
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how the dishes are done,
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how the laundry’s done.
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They’ve got all of their chores,
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all their routines together.
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Then you come together and we talk to these couples like,
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oh,
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we’ll just do everything together.
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And that’s,
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I appreciate the idea of,
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hey,
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there’s no one greater than the other,
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But we’ve tried to do dishes together and we both appreciate that.
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We’re both willing to do the chore,
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but we bump into each other.
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It’s just,
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you can’t,
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you can’t both be doing the same thing and we’re not gonna buy two dishwashers.
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We’re not gonna buy two mops,
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You know,
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there’s just limited resources on how we’re going to do these chores together.
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But I say for some of that too is sometimes it’s trial and error just as to what,
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what’s gonna work the best when you first get married and it’s okay to take time to figure out what that’s going to be 100%.
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But we’ve got to break this idea that it’s just,
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oh we’ll do everything.
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Because usually what happens is if everyone is responsible,
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no one’s responsible.
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Why aren’t the dishes done yet?
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Oh,
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I thought you were gonna do it.
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I thought you were going to do it.
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There’s this great book out there called the case for marriage and they did a lot of research about the statistics of how marriage works,
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why marriage works.
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And they’re even really focusing on the economic advantages that married couples have.
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And one of those advantages is division of labor.
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Just like in a corporation,
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you don’t have one person doing all the tasks because then one person is getting overloaded and it slows down the process.
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One of the great things about about marriage is you yes,
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there are two people dirtying dishes and then when you add Children,
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there’s even more people dirtying dishes.
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Tell me about it.
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Especially during the lockdowns or laundry.
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I I don’t understand how someone half my size can produce so much laundry but they do and division of labor being able to say,
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okay,
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you’ve got this.
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I’ve got that.
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It’s important to be able to say,
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okay,
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we’re going to divide this up and we’re going to be responsible for different things.
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But going back to what you were saying sweetheart,
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what does the bible say about that?
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And what do gender roles in marriage really look like?
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Well that’s the thing I could throw in a lot of dead air here right now.
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But I’m not going to because the bible doesn’t get into specific gender roles.
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And a lot of that has to do with the fact that society really dictates gender roles.
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And even right now in America,
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gender roles are going to be different than say gender roles are going to be in Uganda.
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Just because our our cultures are different in societies are different.
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All of these people equally valuable in God’s eyes.
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But that’s societal structure really steps in there to make those definitions of what those roles are.
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And it’s not even cultures as different as like Uganda and the United States.
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Even rural America versus urban America,
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there’s different expectations of how things are done,
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lifestyles are different.
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I mean we’re seeing that all the time with the culture clash we’re dealing with politically in our country.
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And so these gender roles can be very different.
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Our marriage is very different from what a lot of people would think because you’re the primary breadwinner.
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I mean you spend more time working outside the home working to earn an income than I do with your law practice?
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I spend a lot of time with our operation,
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thriving marriage ministry stuff and of course with my military things for six months.
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You were doing both working full time and single mom while I was gone.
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Oh my goodness!
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But I wouldn’t say single mom because I knew you were coming back and I had your support.
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But I absolutely hear you on that,
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I had to step it up to make sure that kiddos were taken care of and that’s key.
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You can have a thriving marriage and it will look very different from the marriage is our marriage looks very different from every other marriage on our street because of career choices.
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I am more involved in our Children’s education than my dad was not because he cared less but because he worked outside the home more where my mom was more involved in our education.
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But even then when my sister was in school,
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both my parents were working.
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So neither of them were doing field trips and stuff and we’ve been able to do that and I tend to do more of those types of things.
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Just because scheduling gender roles are not defined so statically as a lot of people think and it really comes to,
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I think a lot of people with a misreading of Ephesians five.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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So Ephesians five.
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The big verse that when it comes to gender roles that tends to really spark a lot of controversy.
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Get people really angry is 5 22.
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And so I just read it to you right now,
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wives submit to your husbands as to the Lord because the husband is the head of the wife as also christ is the head of the church,
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he himself being the savior of the body that wives submit.
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I’ve seen more articles,
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more anger,
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more frustration about that one little word that I think most of the other things in the bible and I’d say anger really on both sides of you know,
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some some women or some men are saying this wife isn’t submitting enough and needs to toe the line.
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And the other side saying,
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you know know the the wife has to take on more of a role where she’s certainly not going to be a doormat,
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people will use this.
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And there’s other passages in Titus and first peter talk about these things that people will use this as an idea of subservience,
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right?
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And so that’s really where the argument comes in but they’re misreading in this particular text in Ephesians first of all,
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in the greek when you read Ephesians five,
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you know 5 22 the words submit doesn’t actually occur there in the greek And actually if you go back up earlier to 21 and submitting to one another out of reverence for Christ.
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So two people submitted together and we’ll get into what’s going on earlier that cause it’s important that’s the verb.
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So when you go down to wives submit that verb is added in english translations because it doesn’t work in english,
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but that verb doesn’t actually exist.
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The translators are borrowing the earlier verb.
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So this whole argument where we’ve had culture wars and people screaming at each other is over a word that was added by translators because not even there in the greek,
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but when you look at Ephesians,
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the whole Book of Ephesians and really,
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most of paul’s letters are not about prescribing rules and regulations for how you live your life.
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It’s exhorting and encouraging us to be unified in the church.
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Uh,
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and then earlier,
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that’s submitting to one another out of reverence for christ all of that is about how to live wisely and how the church should have been living together.
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And I’ve had someone come up to me after we had had a talk and had asked,
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well,
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okay,
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so who is the head of your household,
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jen,
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is it you,
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is it brian I said it’s jesus because he’s gonna be our leader,
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he needs to be the leader in the household.
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He needs to be the leader in the church.
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And then the rest of us are submitting to him and were then cooperating with each each other.
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But I’d say that you’re the one who is a leader in the household.
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I’m a leader in the household too,
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but I feel that brian that you’re initiating a lot of things and you’re taking the lead on a lot of things for a lot of decisions,
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but you can’t tell me that I’m not substantially involved in a lot of those things and sometimes it has to do with areas specialty or expertise.
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And I’ve always liked the the example of an incident that happened when we were looking to buy a house and I was talking with the realtor and I was talking with the title company about some paperwork for us to sign off on and what I had told them was listen,
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I’m the lawyer,
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I I know what’s going on with this.
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I’m ready to approve this.
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However,
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I want to run this by my my husband first,
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not because he’s a lawyer and because he can way into this more than me because the decision is effectively done.
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But I’m not going to run over brian and not bounce this off of him and tell him this is why I think we should sign off on this and why this is a positive thing and not an issue enrolls should always be subservient to team Team.
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Marriage is the key,
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we’re in this together and every person on the team is gonna have a different role and choose your team if it’s a sports team.
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If it’s a work team,
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whatever teams work because everyone is doing something different towards the same goal and so in our family.
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Um,
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and every family is going to have to choose who is the one that has to have the responsibility to be okay.
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We’ve deliberated this enough.
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This is the decision.
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Every team,
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every organization and that’s not a position of privilege or authority or power.
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It’s a position of responsibility.
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And absolutely.
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And so at some point,
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someone has to say,
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we’re done.
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This is the decision and in our family,
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that that’s usually me,
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that’s the one we talk about it and that’s how it works for us,
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I would say,
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I think that is the best reading of most of the biblical texts.
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But you’ve got to be careful and I would never say that it’s prescriptive.
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I’d say it’s very descriptive because we’ve got to remember of what the society was at the time and what was going on.
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And remember that paul wasn’t giving these household instructions to create a constitution for the family to create.
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Okay,
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this is now how the family should be.
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He was describing family at that time in the context of we’re now resurrection people were now kingdom people.
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Our loyalty is to ge jesus,
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not to Zeus,
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not to the emperor,
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not to the temple in Jerusalem.
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Because the temple is jesus and the temple is now the church were loyal to jesus and we’ve got to live like that.
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And starting with all these with these household instructions.
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Everything that paul says,
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when you look at Ephesians four.
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Starting verse one says,
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I therefore the pro prisoner of the lord urge you to live worthy li of the calling with which you’ve been called.
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You were supposed to live in a worthy manner with all humility,
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gentleness and patience,
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bearing with one another in love.
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Making every effort to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace.
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So paul is talking about the church,
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but that’s what generals really need to be in a marriage,
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generals need to be.
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How are we functioning with gentleness,
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patience,
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bearing with one another humility.
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Keeping the unity of the Spirit and the bond of peace in our relationship.
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So what does that look like though in your mind?
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How does that look like in a marriage to live out that description that paul gave us?
305
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Well,
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I’m gonna tease a little bit here,
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brian and say you’re really good at bearing with me in love,
308
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right?
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That’s mutual.
310
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She puts up with a lot from me.
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But I really think that when you’re every marriage needs to have it interjected into it humility,
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gentleness,
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patience,
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bearing with one another in love,
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keeping that unity of spirit and and that bond of peace to help us to stick together.
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And I think a lot of that is listening to what your spouse is,
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concerns are to what their needs are,
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what their desires are and to be able to the way that I like to put it is in a given situation where a decision needs to be made?
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Of course we’re following God.
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But in the options that we would have to follow God.
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What is the decision that is going to maxim the family?
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Moving forward?
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Moving forward to follow God,
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just benefiting the family.
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We need to hear from each other because your perspective is unique to you.
326
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Your experience is who you are and my experience is unique to me.
327
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And so when we’re looking at this,
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we both bring something to the table.
329
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That is valuable to the decision and that’s where a lot of misunderstandings about leadership.
330
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Good leaders are good listeners.
331
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If you lead in any area and you don’t listen to the people around you,
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you are failing the people that you lied flat out because you may have to make a decision.
333
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You may know things that they don’t know and so you’ve got to make a decision they disagree with perhaps,
334
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but you’ve got to listen and an example because we’re talking about this,
335
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the argument is always gender roles,
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dominance and authority.
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That’s really where people get tied up and that’s why we’re talking about this and why I talk so much about leadership and who makes decisions.
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But I would like to give an example of some people who are making really good decisions right now have recently made good decisions because they listen to their people like what.
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So Chief Bass,
340
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the chief match start in the Air Force shout out,
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You probably aren’t listening to this,
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but if you are.
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Thank you so much because we just in the Air Force received a new regulation about how our uniforms,
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how to wear our uniforms and everything that changed in there really came from the Airmen in the Air Force wanting something different.
345
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Things that me,
346
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the old crusty senior N.
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C.
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O.
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Why are we doing this?
350
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I think this is stupid.
351
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I think it looks unprofessional.
352
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But Chief Bass listening to the Airman decided her and her team decided no,
353
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we’re going to do this because I’m going to listen to the airman and let them know that I hear about them and care about them.
354
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Hands in pockets forever.
355
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We haven’t been allowed to keep our hands in our pockets when we’re walking when we’re standing hands in your pockets.
356
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Well now we can walking with the cell phone.
357
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The rule has always been,
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if you’re gonna talk your cellphone,
359
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you stop,
360
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step off the sidewalk,
361
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finish your conversation and then keep walking.
362
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Those are things that change.
363
00:19:28,960 –> 00:19:34,520
Not necessarily because they’re going to make us the Air force fly jets better,
364
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but they’re going to make the community better.
365
00:19:37,320 –> 00:19:37,610
Hey,
366
00:19:37,610 –> 00:19:40,940
these are the things the airmen want and that’s going to make us fly jets better.
367
00:19:40,950 –> 00:19:42,750
So that’s the same way with us,
368
00:19:42,750 –> 00:19:43,000
right?
369
00:19:43,000 –> 00:19:43,780
When you’re leading,
370
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when we’re making decisions,
371
00:19:44,830 –> 00:19:48,100
we’ve got to hear from each other and then make decisions,
372
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even if it’s like that’s not the decision I want to make or I would make.
373
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But I’m listening and we’re gonna make sure that everyone’s involved and encouraged and we’re all focus on growing more like jesus,
374
00:19:59,550 –> 00:20:04,660
but what I also wanted to delve into a little bit more is what you have brought up a little bit ago,
375
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which is just talking about being domineering and I think that if you’ve got a domineering wife or a domineering husband in a relationship,
376
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it’s,
377
00:20:14,200 –> 00:20:18,680
it’s gonna rip the couple apart and it’s going to result in a bad marriage,
378
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if not a divorce.
379
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Ultimately that would happen.
380
00:20:21,130 –> 00:20:32,210
It’s just not a healthy environment and anything that jesus would command of wives behave like this or husbands behave like that.
381
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A lot of those instructions.
382
00:20:34,180 –> 00:20:38,300
I see that as if you’re going to be that people of christ,
383
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it’s across the board,
384
00:20:40,020 –> 00:20:45,530
although those specific directions to a husband to a wife have to be be handled,
385
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but if the idea that someone would walk away with that is I’m going to be domineering and I’m going to be oppressive and unkind towards my spouse.
386
00:20:55,230 –> 00:20:58,470
That just doesn’t jive with what the bible says,
387
00:20:58,480 –> 00:20:59,970
dominance is never okay,
388
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being a good christ follower,
389
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you cannot be a dominant domineering person.
390
00:21:04,860 –> 00:21:06,220
Our example is jesus,
391
00:21:06,380 –> 00:21:14,590
he showed up in the most humble way possible and died in the most embarrassing way possible at the time because he loved us so much.
392
00:21:14,600 –> 00:21:16,720
Everything we have comes from God,
393
00:21:16,720 –> 00:21:20,470
giving of himself to us and he doesn’t get anything back.
394
00:21:20,830 –> 00:21:23,750
There’s nothing that he gains from us,
395
00:21:23,750 –> 00:21:26,310
He gives everything out of love.
396
00:21:26,360 –> 00:21:29,510
God has the power to be dominant and he’s not,
397
00:21:29,750 –> 00:21:30,050
you know,
398
00:21:30,050 –> 00:21:30,560
Yes,
399
00:21:30,560 –> 00:21:31,860
he is supreme.
400
00:21:31,860 –> 00:21:32,050
Yes,
401
00:21:32,050 –> 00:21:32,980
he is sovereign,
402
00:21:32,990 –> 00:21:42,920
but his nature is to give and domineering and dominance is just not uh the way christians live,
403
00:21:42,930 –> 00:21:50,640
that’s not what you do and that doesn’t matter what level of leadership where you are um in the church outside the church and this is the great thing.
404
00:21:50,640 –> 00:21:55,640
We have the opportunity we have as a couple because we,
405
00:21:55,890 –> 00:22:03,230
when we follow these household regulations that are these household rules that paul puts out,
406
00:22:03,240 –> 00:22:08,910
we get to be an example to our church family and to our neighborhood,
407
00:22:08,910 –> 00:22:09,750
to our community,
408
00:22:09,750 –> 00:22:18,130
to our co workers about what true loving and truly living in God’s kingdom looks like that’s very much the case.
409
00:22:18,130 –> 00:22:21,280
And you look at the book of titus very quickly.
410
00:22:21,280 –> 00:22:36,260
It it talks about doing your duties and your roles that are supposed to be connected to the household and I would argue that that’s going to be different between what the different households are and how you’ve structured how,
411
00:22:36,270 –> 00:22:38,850
how chores would be taken care of.
412
00:22:38,860 –> 00:22:39,510
But again,
413
00:22:39,510 –> 00:22:40,580
whatever you’re doing,
414
00:22:40,590 –> 00:22:42,550
you do that to the glory of God.
415
00:22:42,560 –> 00:22:52,430
And I think with a lot of things you have to be somewhat liquid that things can change just that that kind of flex and flow.
416
00:22:52,430 –> 00:23:11,780
If you have a spouse who’s sick if you have a spouse who’s out of town due to deployment or otherwise that you’d have to sometimes step up and fill out some duties or maybe you’re changing different duties just as your marriage continues on and the household grows because sometimes when you’re dealing with babies,
417
00:23:11,790 –> 00:23:13,860
you need to be doing laundry all the time.
418
00:23:13,860 –> 00:23:15,200
And that’s just a fact.
419
00:23:15,210 –> 00:23:15,520
Yeah.
420
00:23:15,530 –> 00:23:19,760
So we’ve talked about kind of these household regulations and what it looks like in the home.
421
00:23:19,850 –> 00:23:29,730
Let’s jump a little bit earlier in the bible and talk about the nature of masculinity and femininity rolling all the way.
422
00:23:29,730 –> 00:23:34,320
And we’re probably going to either side of the egalitarian and complementary in argument,
423
00:23:34,320 –> 00:23:35,790
we’re probably going to make both mad,
424
00:23:35,890 –> 00:23:36,320
um,
425
00:23:36,330 –> 00:23:38,670
for those of you who aren’t familiar with those theological terms.
426
00:23:38,670 –> 00:23:46,510
Egalitarian at its most extreme is the idea that men and women creating the image of God are completely equal.
427
00:23:46,510 –> 00:23:48,460
There’s no difference whatsoever.
428
00:23:48,470 –> 00:23:51,630
I know that’s a thumbnail sketch all of you.
429
00:23:51,640 –> 00:23:52,910
Egalitarian theologians.
430
00:23:52,910 –> 00:23:54,070
You can make fun of me later.
431
00:23:54,080 –> 00:23:55,750
That’s the extreme side of it.
432
00:23:55,760 –> 00:24:02,980
On the extreme complimentary inside is the difference the coinciding differences between men and women.
433
00:24:02,990 –> 00:24:08,170
And they’ve taken that to the point where women belong in the home belong doing the dishes,
434
00:24:08,180 –> 00:24:14,100
making the food a lot of those traditional agrarian roles that women took on while the men were outside home.
435
00:24:14,100 –> 00:24:20,780
So those are the extreme examples on this continuum and we’re not on either side of that totally.
436
00:24:20,780 –> 00:24:21,790
But we do want to talk about,
437
00:24:21,790 –> 00:24:27,420
there is something about masculinity and femininity and there are differences.
438
00:24:27,560 –> 00:24:30,720
Men and women aren’t just biologically and physically different.
439
00:24:31,110 –> 00:24:39,930
And this is documented time and time again about how women perceive even something as simple as you see more colors than I do.
440
00:24:39,950 –> 00:24:41,090
And truth.
441
00:24:41,100 –> 00:24:52,590
We joke about this when we’re picking paint colors and finally we just give up and you pick the paint color because I can’t see the difference of the colors in genesis 2 18 The Lord God said it is not good for the man to be alone.
442
00:24:52,600 –> 00:24:57,190
I will make a command a companion for him who corresponds to him,
443
00:24:57,200 –> 00:25:00,550
that companion who corresponds to him.
444
00:25:00,560 –> 00:25:06,550
That is traditionally translated with the english word helper.
445
00:25:07,300 –> 00:25:15,000
And what’s your reaction when you hear that woman was created to be man’s help.
446
00:25:15,010 –> 00:25:17,410
What’s your initial reaction to hearing that?
447
00:25:17,420 –> 00:25:17,740
Well,
448
00:25:17,740 –> 00:25:21,060
I think it’s about taking it in the context of what the bible is,
449
00:25:21,070 –> 00:25:21,440
right,
450
00:25:21,450 –> 00:25:32,190
because God describes himself as a helper to people and he’s the ceo the creator of the youth universe,
451
00:25:32,200 –> 00:25:37,310
but he’s still there to be helpful to us as his Children.
452
00:25:37,320 –> 00:25:39,970
I’m I’m there to help Jonathan,
453
00:25:39,970 –> 00:25:40,910
our 10 year old,
454
00:25:40,910 –> 00:25:43,130
although sometimes I’m giving him way more help,
455
00:25:43,130 –> 00:25:52,600
which I’m and I’m sure that that for a given task and I’m sure that God is continually giving me more help in a given task than I’m even understanding,
456
00:25:52,630 –> 00:26:03,170
but I think that that’s the thing where the woman was created not to be a slave or a complete servant of the man,
457
00:26:03,180 –> 00:26:06,130
but to be that corresponding helper.
458
00:26:06,140 –> 00:26:07,690
But he was already there.
459
00:26:07,690 –> 00:26:14,650
So I’m thinking he’s there to be that corresponding helper for her as well under the lordship of of God.
460
00:26:14,660 –> 00:26:17,510
A lot of people have a problem with that word helper though,
461
00:26:17,510 –> 00:26:17,920
right?
462
00:26:18,130 –> 00:26:18,360
You know,
463
00:26:18,360 –> 00:26:25,710
a lot of people feel that helper is by definition the way helper is thought of in our culture,
464
00:26:25,720 –> 00:26:33,440
they think of helper as being less than even how we use it in professional like teaching or um environments.
465
00:26:33,440 –> 00:26:34,710
You’ve got the teacher’s helper,
466
00:26:34,720 –> 00:26:38,030
you’ve got the teacher and then you got the teacher’s helper.
467
00:26:38,160 –> 00:26:42,940
Teacher’s helper is important but they can’t do anything on their own.
468
00:26:42,950 –> 00:26:47,690
They only do what the teacher tells them and that’s not the intent,
469
00:26:47,690 –> 00:26:48,390
which I like,
470
00:26:48,410 –> 00:26:53,750
I like the N E T translation better because it translates that word and for the bible nerds,
471
00:26:53,760 –> 00:26:57,650
it’s the word eser is the word used and like jen said,
472
00:26:57,670 –> 00:27:05,370
God uses that word to describe himself a lot in this um not a rock band but sounds like it.
473
00:27:05,380 –> 00:27:11,610
Wheezer did an awesome cover of Toto’s africa easer is the word that God uses for helper.
474
00:27:11,620 –> 00:27:17,810
There’s this article in judaica in 86 by Rosenzweig,
475
00:27:17,820 –> 00:27:20,420
I apologize sir if I totally brutalized your name,
476
00:27:20,670 –> 00:27:30,820
but at the end of it says the woman would supply what the man was lacking in the design of creation and logically it would follow that the man would supply what she was lacking.
477
00:27:30,830 –> 00:27:32,430
Although it is not stated here.
478
00:27:32,580 –> 00:27:34,740
So here’s what the helper does.
479
00:27:34,750 –> 00:27:38,830
They bring something to the table that the original did not have.
480
00:27:38,850 –> 00:27:42,080
So you bring something to the table that I don’t have.
481
00:27:42,140 –> 00:27:42,700
You know,
482
00:27:42,710 –> 00:27:43,750
your intellect,
483
00:27:43,750 –> 00:27:45,160
your way of doing things.
484
00:27:45,160 –> 00:27:49,310
You bring something to our marriage and something to me that was lacking.
485
00:27:49,350 –> 00:27:50,900
Oh and likewise you for me,
486
00:27:50,900 –> 00:27:51,240
right?
487
00:27:51,250 –> 00:27:51,820
Absolutely.
488
00:27:51,830 –> 00:27:52,760
And you,
489
00:27:52,770 –> 00:27:54,780
you are the one who’s structured,
490
00:27:54,790 –> 00:28:08,360
You’re the one who’s planning and organizing and gets very specific and you are also really good at making sure we’re accomplishing something as a family that we’re moving forward that we’re doing something that we’re being responsible.
491
00:28:08,410 –> 00:28:09,370
That’s very true.
492
00:28:09,370 –> 00:28:15,010
Although looking at the top of my desk or the organizational thing would say otherwise.
493
00:28:15,010 –> 00:28:16,010
But that’s very true.
494
00:28:16,010 –> 00:28:23,600
We like to be regimented in some of these things and make sure that that’s good to go for the family and I’m the one that’s going to bring spontaneity always.
495
00:28:23,610 –> 00:28:25,140
I’m the one that’s going to,
496
00:28:25,340 –> 00:28:26,510
let’s go play.
497
00:28:26,560 –> 00:28:28,810
This is just let’s go do something crazy.
498
00:28:28,890 –> 00:28:30,100
And then you look at me,
499
00:28:30,100 –> 00:28:30,370
it’s like,
500
00:28:30,370 –> 00:28:30,670
okay,
501
00:28:30,670 –> 00:28:34,630
that’s really crazy and then I convinced you to do the crazy thing with me.
502
00:28:35,440 –> 00:28:38,810
I’m checking the funds to make sure we can facilitate the crazy.
503
00:28:38,820 –> 00:28:42,110
Like buying my beautiful 55 gallon saltwater aquarium that I enjoy.
504
00:28:42,120 –> 00:28:42,620
Oh that’s,
505
00:28:42,620 –> 00:28:45,270
that’s another podcast episode altogether babe.
506
00:28:45,280 –> 00:28:48,990
But then also at the same time when it comes to discipline,
507
00:28:49,040 –> 00:28:52,710
I’m more comfortable in the role of okay,
508
00:28:52,720 –> 00:28:55,080
now we’re going to enforce the discipline with the Children,
509
00:28:55,090 –> 00:28:56,240
not that you don’t,
510
00:28:56,240 –> 00:28:57,400
you discipline the Children,
511
00:28:57,410 –> 00:29:00,490
but I’m more comfortable in that role and as parents,
512
00:29:00,500 –> 00:29:01,530
as a team,
513
00:29:01,810 –> 00:29:03,750
I’m the one who oftentimes is bringing the,
514
00:29:03,750 –> 00:29:05,880
okay now we’re gonna do this,
515
00:29:05,890 –> 00:29:08,520
you’re the one making sure our family structure and everything.
516
00:29:08,520 –> 00:29:18,040
But when it comes down to one of us has to get control of the Children a little more and communicate discipline and enforce um those consequences.
517
00:29:18,050 –> 00:29:18,940
I’m my temperament,
518
00:29:18,940 –> 00:29:19,920
I’m more comfortable with that.
519
00:29:19,930 –> 00:29:21,050
That’s very true.
520
00:29:21,060 –> 00:29:27,660
Also we need to leave room to say we’re talking about our marriage and this is how we’ve worked it out.
521
00:29:27,670 –> 00:29:30,330
But there are so many different people,
522
00:29:30,330 –> 00:29:34,960
different talents and in their marriages where they can be very,
523
00:29:34,960 –> 00:29:38,640
very successful in their marriages even though they’re very different.
524
00:29:38,650 –> 00:29:44,440
And brian was kind of looking at me because I was googling on my cell phone because this is the podcast,
525
00:29:44,920 –> 00:29:45,330
right?
526
00:29:45,340 –> 00:29:48,270
But brian is looking at me weird because I’m googling on my cell phone,
527
00:29:48,270 –> 00:29:48,870
ralph Lauren,
528
00:29:48,870 –> 00:29:49,220
he’s like,
529
00:29:49,220 –> 00:29:49,500
gosh,
530
00:29:49,500 –> 00:29:52,220
are you shopping while we’re recording this podcast?
531
00:29:52,280 –> 00:30:01,070
But I was looking up Ralph Lauren personally because a lot of times people will think of women as being for Very fashion forward.
532
00:30:01,070 –> 00:30:03,860
But he’s a very successful designer.
533
00:30:03,860 –> 00:30:07,420
So he might have more of that eye for color than I’m gonna have.
534
00:30:07,450 –> 00:30:08,740
Even as a woman,
535
00:30:08,750 –> 00:30:14,910
he’s been married since 1960 for and he and his wife have three Children together.
536
00:30:14,940 –> 00:30:22,500
So even though he’s not necessarily in a stereotypical industry being led by men,
537
00:30:22,500 –> 00:30:28,550
he certainly is a man who has the lead in that particular company and has been very successful at that.
538
00:30:28,560 –> 00:30:32,650
And I’d be interested to peek into how his family is because again,
539
00:30:32,660 –> 00:30:34,920
happily married since 1964.
540
00:30:34,940 –> 00:30:35,320
Yeah,
541
00:30:35,320 –> 00:30:36,170
that’s interesting.
542
00:30:36,170 –> 00:30:37,560
And you make a good point.
543
00:30:37,570 –> 00:30:41,040
We share illustrations from our marriage because that’s the marriage we know best.
544
00:30:41,240 –> 00:30:52,030
But it’s definitely there are things that are moving and it’s different for your marriage and we don’t want to ever say your marriage should be like our marriage because it absolutely shouldn’t because you’re not us,
545
00:30:52,260 –> 00:30:58,080
but at the same time we do want to say that you complement each other,
546
00:30:58,500 –> 00:30:59,870
whatever that is,
547
00:30:59,880 –> 00:31:05,600
You bring something to your spouse that they need and your spouse brings something to you that you need.
548
00:31:05,610 –> 00:31:09,850
And it’s very unique to your relationship.
549
00:31:09,860 –> 00:31:17,220
But it’s important that you acknowledge that and are ready to work in that.
550
00:31:17,230 –> 00:31:20,740
And sometimes it’s going to be clear from,
551
00:31:20,750 –> 00:31:21,080
hey,
552
00:31:21,080 –> 00:31:22,890
this is what things look like in the bible.
553
00:31:22,890 –> 00:31:25,970
Sometimes you’re gonna look at things and look at the side again,
554
00:31:26,330 –> 00:31:32,800
an asian family versus the north american families structure is going to be different because the culture is different.
555
00:31:32,800 –> 00:31:34,510
That’s okay different parts of the world.
556
00:31:34,520 –> 00:31:36,010
It’s going to be different.
557
00:31:36,020 –> 00:31:43,180
You need to define those roles and you need to allow yourselves and each other to be complements to each other.
558
00:31:43,240 –> 00:31:45,990
That’s really where it comes down to in gender roles.
559
00:31:46,000 –> 00:31:48,680
It’s not the woman will do this,
560
00:31:48,690 –> 00:31:49,930
the man will do this.
561
00:31:50,000 –> 00:31:54,040
There are uniqueness is there are differences where they complement each other,
562
00:31:54,050 –> 00:32:00,400
but you need to define what your roles are and you need to work to complement each other.
563
00:32:00,400 –> 00:32:02,860
If you want to thrive as a couple,
564
00:32:02,910 –> 00:32:04,630
it can’t be competition,
565
00:32:04,790 –> 00:32:06,970
it can’t be dominance,
566
00:32:07,010 –> 00:32:09,400
it can’t be my way or the highway.
567
00:32:09,410 –> 00:32:13,000
And it can’t be one of those situations where,
568
00:32:13,150 –> 00:32:13,500
you know,
569
00:32:13,500 –> 00:32:16,440
we teach our kids when they’re playing games when you’ve got it.
570
00:32:16,440 –> 00:32:17,370
You got it,
571
00:32:17,370 –> 00:32:17,670
I got it,
572
00:32:17,670 –> 00:32:18,100
I got it.
573
00:32:18,110 –> 00:32:19,720
You cannot be out there,
574
00:32:19,720 –> 00:32:20,250
you get it,
575
00:32:20,250 –> 00:32:20,690
you get it,
576
00:32:20,690 –> 00:32:21,220
you get it,
577
00:32:21,230 –> 00:32:22,390
you gotta work together.
578
00:32:22,400 –> 00:32:23,380
Hey,
579
00:32:23,390 –> 00:32:25,430
I’m going to use a baseball analogy here,
580
00:32:25,440 –> 00:32:26,580
You’re in center field,
581
00:32:26,590 –> 00:32:27,460
I’m in right field.
582
00:32:27,470 –> 00:32:28,600
If it’s in right field,
583
00:32:28,610 –> 00:32:29,160
I got it.
584
00:32:29,170 –> 00:32:30,300
If it’s in center field,
585
00:32:30,310 –> 00:32:31,690
then I don’t have to tell you,
586
00:32:31,690 –> 00:32:33,390
you got it because you’re gonna be yelling at me.
587
00:32:33,390 –> 00:32:33,910
I got it,
588
00:32:33,910 –> 00:32:34,370
I got it,
589
00:32:34,380 –> 00:32:39,880
I got it and we got to fill those gaps together and there will be conflict.
590
00:32:40,390 –> 00:32:44,870
There’s gonna be times where you disagree on what it is,
591
00:32:44,870 –> 00:32:50,810
especially early on in marriage when you’re just learning how to live together,
592
00:32:50,820 –> 00:32:51,780
there’s gonna be conflict.
593
00:32:51,780 –> 00:32:54,610
But also every phase when things change,
594
00:32:54,850 –> 00:32:56,210
there’s gonna be conflict.
595
00:32:56,740 –> 00:33:05,270
And so you’ve got to work that conflict out together and be comfortable discussing that and then building that relationship,
596
00:33:05,280 –> 00:33:06,750
identifying those roles,
597
00:33:06,750 –> 00:33:08,060
complimenting each other.
598
00:33:08,060 –> 00:33:10,630
Then you can move forward together as a couple.
599
00:33:11,060 –> 00:33:14,390
Thank you for joining us on the operation thriving marriage podcast.
600
00:33:14,720 –> 00:33:24,960
We want to be a part of God’s plan for marriage is to thrive around the world and you can help us do that by subscribing rating and reviewing this podcast on whatever service you use as an added bonus.
601
00:33:25,070 –> 00:33:26,780
If you subscribe or review,
602
00:33:26,790 –> 00:33:29,350
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603
00:33:29,350 –> 00:33:30,840
Operation thriving marriage.
604
00:33:30,850 –> 00:33:32,810
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605
00:33:32,820 –> 00:33:37,500
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606
00:33:37,500 –> 00:33:38,540
thriving marriage.
607
00:33:38,980 –> 00:33:41,940
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608
00:33:42,140 –> 00:33:47,750
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609
00:33:47,890 –> 00:33:54,140
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610
00:33:54,150 –> 00:33:57,310
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611
00:33:57,320 –> 00:34:00,180
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612
00:34:00,340 –> 00:34:02,360
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613
00:34:02,360 –> 00:34:04,540
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614
00:34:04,680 –> 00:34:06,560
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615
00:34:06,560 –> 00:34:07,880
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616
00:34:07,880 –> 00:34:10,930
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617
00:34:10,930 –> 00:34:13,340
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618
00:34:13,350 –> 00:34:17,000
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619
00:34:17,010 –> 00:34:18,690
We look forward to meeting you in person.
